In this episode, Kirk Nordenstrom sits down with Spencer and Jared Harvey, the brother duo behind some of the most inventive and award-winning films in Seattle 48HFP history. Known for their creative risk-taking, polished production, and occasional sibling tension, the Harveys share what it’s like to work with family under extreme time pressure—and why they keep coming back for more. They also break down their viral split-screen film “Negative Split,” how they plan their visual storytelling, and what’s changed in their filmmaking process over the years. Whether you’re a 48HFP rookie or a returning champion, this episode is packed with insight and laughs.
Meet The Harvey Brothers, a sibling filmmaking duo known for their chaotic energy, absurdist comedy, and creative ingenuity
How they first got involved in the 48 Hour Film Project—and what keeps them coming back
Behind-the-scenes stories from their wildest (and weirdest) weekends
The power of saying “yes” during a 48
Why comedy under pressure might be the hardest—and most rewarding—genre
How working with your brother can be both your greatest asset and your biggest challenge
Thoughts on collaboration, risk-taking, and building a unique creative voice
Favorite moments, lessons learned, and what’s next for the Harveys
🎧 Tune in for a hilarious and heartfelt ride through the high-speed world of sibling-powered filmmaking.
🔗 Learn more and register for a 48HFP city near you at 48hourfilm.com
4HHOS-EP03-TheHarveyBrothers
Kirk: [00:00:00] Hello and welcome to episode three of 48 Hour Heroes Origin Stories. I'm your host, Kirk Nordstrom. They ran the team Challenge accepted for several years in the early 2000 tens in Seattle, and they won Best in City twice in 2014, they went for their film I Cherin, which went on to Film Palooza and took best ensemble acting and third place overall.
It also went on to the special 48 hour film project screening at the Can Short Film Corner, and I wanted to talk to them because they're two guys who really embraced what the 48 is about. Not only in terms of the filmmaking event, but also what it could do for them socially, professionally, on a local level, and also on a global level from going to Film of Palooza several times.
So join [00:01:00] me in a pretty lengthy discussion about the 48 hour film project with Kevin and Philip Harvey.
Alright, welcome to 48 Hour Heroes Origin story. Today I am talking with two longtime Seattle competitors and two time best in city winners. Kevin and Philip Harvey from Team Challenge accepted. So welcome Kevin and Philip. Thank you. Hey, good to be here. What was the first year you did, you did the 48 in Seattle?
Phillip: The first year we were working. With Peter Fesa, who I think we had a different team name every time, but in, in my head, I, I consider it sort of like the, the precursor to what eventually became challenge accepted as we kind of split different ways. Wow. In terms of what [00:02:00] year it was, it might've been, was that, was the, was that the Gay Vampire with aids?
We did one before that.
Kirk: Oh, okay.
Phillip: Yeah. Moments in Time.
Kirk: Oh, moments in Time. I
Phillip: love that one. Yeah. That moments in Time had mixed reactions.
Kirk: Yeah, it was, I, I remember that because, uh, it's memorable for sure. Yeah. I was, and it's now the, I think it's pretty much relegated to second place in terms of the amount of vomit in the Seattle 48 film now.
Oh is Oh, really cool. I had one this summer that was, oh boy.
Phillip: It's not a throw night. I care about sitting on.
Kirk: Yeah. Uh, yeah, but I, I remember that one. So for those of you in the audience, it just this beautiful summer day and people are enjoying their [00:03:00] lives and then everyone starts vomiting it.
Phillip: It was, I mean, we really just.
Went for surprise ending hard, I guess
Kevin: very basic interpretation, I think. Uh,
Phillip: yeah, yeah. But effective if, yeah.
Kevin: Um, I think what was cool about
Phillip: that is, you know, we just had fun. We didn't have any expectations. We were just trying to make something and, and, and we did. It was our first time kind of getting that audience reaction thing.
Yeah. Where you experience your movie playing in a theater for the first time. Um, and, you know, I'm just. Petrified in the audience. Uh, 'cause it's just, there's, uh, for me anyway, there's few things scarier than presenting something like that. And so I'm just sweating the whole time. And it's dead sound in the theater.
'cause we've got this basically cliche slowmo, like, and it was a little tedious after a while, you know? Mm-hmm. And you can tell people are maybe [00:04:00] getting bored and then the, the puke starts happening and the theater just erupts with laughter. Um, so we definitely made
Kevin: an impact. You know, it wasn't, it wasn't, uh, anything too cinematic or storytelling wise, but uh, yeah,
Phillip: it's the first experience getting that much of a rise out of an audience.
And I think that kind of started off our desire to keep trying to get laughs in the future. Yeah, for sure. I agree with that. I remember even at one point, hearing, hearing someone behind me say like, whisper to their friend. Their is taking this too long. 'cause it was very slow. Everything was slow motion.
It was pretty well shot and just haunting and beautiful. And there's these people in picnics and someone playing guitar. And then it just, it just at the very end, it kind of like lulls you into this zone. And then it just, like the whole thing, once people [00:05:00] start throwing up, and I don't know why they do, they just do, the whole short is over within like 10 seconds.
It is just like, it's like a couple minutes of this haunting, whimsical thing. You see people making eyes at each other and someone's making a sketch and you kind of wonder what's gonna happen and then it just ends. I remember my, my dad was actually really upset about it because it was pretty young and, and.
Amateur filmmakers at the time, you know, and, and Peter Faso deserves credit too. 'cause I mean, we didn't just make that Peter Faso had, like, it was on his camera and he did a lot of, he was basically the DP and helped edit and put a lot of work in. When my dad was watching that, he, it was, he was really proud of us and he was really excited 'cause it was this first very beautiful visual piece and he was just like, I was, I was getting just so enraptured in it and then, and then it's just like a slap in the face at the end.
And it was just all for nothing.
Kevin: Yeah. I, I have one. I know we don't want to get hung up too much. [00:06:00] We barely, yeah.
Phillip: We're
Kevin: only on
Phillip: short one. I have one potentially Cuttable anecdote that I just remember was an interesting thing and Kevin Deaton was. The actor in that, and he did a fantastic job. He's very captivating, but it was also kind of an interesting experience because, you know, he takes his, his role seriously and he needed to have some sort of like motivation or reason as to why everybody started throwing up, including himself.
So remember being on the spot and trying to, to come up with the reason why he just starts throwing up. And I think it was something about how like, the beauty of life just becomes overwhelming or something.
Kirk: Well, I, I remember sitting in the theater and, um, there's this couple, obviously on a date and they were done.
Totally dressed up, and the moment [00:07:00] the vomit happened, woman just stood up and stormed out and the poor guy was like, oh, this is this. This was a bad choice for a date. And I didn't see him come back after that.
Kevin: Yeah, I mean, I think that's, that's one of the key things to take
Phillip: away is that as a filmmaker and when you have butts in seats watching your movie, you have a lot of power.
And that's one of the really awesome things about the 48 hour film festivals that as an indie filmmaker, there's not that many times, not that many chances you get. To have that many people in the room, like dialed in and focused on what you have to show. So yeah. You know, treat that power how you will.
Kirk: Well, I remember, you know, going along a couple of years later,
Phillip: do you remember what year that was? By the way? It's like [00:08:00] 2011 or 13, or,
Kirk: well, okay, so, well, you guys won 2013 and 2014. And 2012 was when penguins fly. So that must have been 2010 or 2011.
Phillip: Okay. Yeah. When Penguins fly was like the first official challenge.
Accepted team. Yeah. Yeah. Which will be a. Fun and painful story to, to remember.
Kirk: I still tell it to this day. That was 10 years ago.
Kevin: It's a teachable moment,
Kirk: especially with team. Awesome. Following you guys around
Phillip: Yeah. To get it on camera too.
Kirk: Uh, well, I mean, let's just, let's just dive into that. So, 2012, that was our first year, uh, screening at the Uptown.
So we'd, you know, switched from Harvard exit to the Seattle International Film Festival venue [00:09:00] and we hosted the kickoff and drop off at CIF Film Center and team. Awesome. Which is another team that had been doing it for a few years and always, you know, an audience favorite, you know, most years took home an award or two.
Never took the big prize, but, so they decided they wanted to make a. Documentary following three teams and actually have it done in time for the screening, which they amazingly pulled off and it was, you know, the, the doc was good for how quickly they turned it around. It was, that
Phillip: was their own little 48
Kirk: of their making.
Yeah. I mean, I mean, I got it into the screening I think an hour before the first screening that that's how fast they turned it around. Yeah. Did it play before? Yeah. Okay. Yeah. You know, I mean, I can describe the kickoff and drop off, but, you know, I only ever see it from my side of the curtain. Um, did you guys, you know, kind of describe, you know, what it's like to be in, you know, the kickoff and dropoff [00:10:00] event?
Phillip: Yeah. You know, I think that one, well, I won't, I won't dig up. My first initial memories, I was just gonna think it, it was this dropoff in kickoff was at Seattle Center, which was actually a little nicer because it used to be. More down south. And I remember that was always just the dropoff was, is always a harrowing time.
And, and it's weird because I remember the dropoffs sort of in league with where technology was at the time. Mm-hmm. Like I remember dropping off, like we would have the DBD burning on the way to the thing and trying not to jostle the laptop. And then, you know, eventually you're not submitting it on a DVD anymore, you've got a flash drive.
So the pickup is, is pretty exciting. You know, you get together, you go in. So at the time that was at one of, uh, I think a small theater space or something on the SF campus in Seattle [00:11:00] Center.
Kirk: Yeah. We were in the, the lobby. The lobby and we're kind of bringing, we had people upstairs, kind of the holding pen and then we bring 'em down group by group and Right.
Phillip: But that's always exciting 'cause you just, you don't know what you're gonna get. We, we always just went in blind. I mean, there, I think there are certain teams that, that just, I, I don't know. It's like you, it's your natural impulse to wanna prepare as much as possible. But we always just really am, there's just not that many ways you can prepare.
'cause you don't know what you're going to get. Obviously you've, you've gotta get your, like actors and stuff lined up. You've gotta get your gear and locations if, if you can. And we always just really embrace that. We just, we don't know what we're gonna get and we, we just start completely fresh. It's one of the things I really love about it.
So Friday night we get together with sort of like the close knit crew. We go to the kickoff ceremony, we find out what we're going to get. And it's always just really [00:12:00] exciting and nerve wracking. 'cause I, I think for a lot of filmmakers you're always nervous that you're gonna pull something like drama or, or musical or something like that, that's really gonna challenge you.
And for us, I actually think we weren't as concerned about the difficulty of pulling something like drama at the time. We were working more in filmmaking in just a video production industry. And so it was really important for us that the 48 was also like this really fun weekend. And I think we always felt like if we got something like drama, it wasn't gonna be as fun as if we got, we wanted to get laughs, we wanted to be able to Yeah.
Have it be goofy and funny. Yeah, totally. Um, so that was always really exciting. And then you get your, you get your. Genre and then we, we would just go out and maybe have some beers and just try to keep like a, a smaller group of people so there's not too many chefs in the kitchen. And Friday evening we would [00:13:00] just figure out the story and we can get more into story stuff later.
And the drop off, the 48 hour drop off, is it just. A pretty well constructed heart attack every, every time. I mean, it's just by design. You don't have that much time. And on Sunday when you're getting ready to export your film and you know, get the deliverables ready, make all those finishing touches, there's just never enough time.
Even if you think you have enough time when you wake up Sunday morning or if you even slept that night, it's just every little second matters and you really feel that GPU purchase or how fast the computer is that you're editing on, all of that stuff matters when you're in that crunch time. And then it's just all, all the things that you can't control, like traffic.
I remember, I think it might even be in the documentary, uh, [00:14:00] but I remember dropping off when penguins fly. We were working in Bellevue and I. We've gotta get to Seattle Center and for some reason, five 20 was shut down. Which is the main like it normally is. Yeah, yeah. Which is the main bridge that goes from Bellevue to basically directly to Seattle Center.
So we had to go the long way, of course, with everyone else in the city. So we were stuck in traffic, you know, trying, trying to get there on time. And I remember Ty just, Ty was just pretty funny. He's just impersonating the city planners just like,
yeah, you know, five 20, let's just shut it down. Just shut it down
Phillip: there.
There was other times where I think we talked Phil into running a red light, uh, trying to get there. You know, I don't encourage that type of thing, but like, it really becomes crunch time to, to get it in on time. Wouldn't that be the worst is to just. Go through that whole weekend. All the [00:15:00] people, everyone involved.
And I think we've even turned, when I was working with Peter Faso, we may have turned one in late before, but like 30 seconds later, 60 seconds later something it screens, but you're disqualified and it's just, I think
Kirk: Blood
Phillip: Love was late. I
Kirk: think it was late. Believe it was. And I had to convince him to, to actually screen it.
Yeah. Yeah.
Phillip: Which, which is definitely worth doing. 'cause you're still eligible for the Audience Choice Award, which,
Kirk: which Blood Love one handling. Yeah.
Phillip: Yeah. And that still feels good, you know? Yeah. It's still worth it.
Kirk: I remember in the documentary, when you guys are checking the DVD. You know, the data, DVD with the film, uh, one of you looks at the file and goes 80 megs.
Huh? That's small. It was less than that. I think it was like 13 or something, or Yeah, three. It was small. That opened a can of worms that I'd never had to deal with. Yeah. I remember because, you know, I'm an editor so I know how, you know, final Cut makes [00:16:00] a reference movie. Yeah. And I was like, and there's real, there's no way to fake it.
Yeah.
Phillip: So
Kirk: I,
Phillip: I
Kirk: could, I could paint that technical story too, if you want to. Uh, we don't need to go into the details, but I mean, there's really no. Way to fake it. Yeah. You know, with that file. But I remember it was such a weird situation. It was the only time that had come up. Yeah. And I was kind of surprised, you know, thinking about it.
That was the only time it came up. I was
Phillip: too, and we were so close to, to getting it right. And it just blew my mind how it could even happen in the first place because Ty and I worked in video production. Like we, and Ty was a, a great editor and this was Final Cut Pro at the time. And uh, and there was this, when you edit in Final Cut Pro, you can, a lot of times you'll just export right out of Final Cut Pro and make a self-contained movie file.
Yeah. I, I don't know how it's possible, but Ty had never exported out of Final Cut Pro [00:17:00] directly. He would always send it to Compressor first, and there's this checkbox that you have to, it's on by default, which I always thought was
Kirk: stupid.
Phillip: Yeah. It's, it was really, it's not on by default. Like you have to, the first time you ever make an export, you have to click make movie self-contained, otherwise it exports a reference file.
Yeah. Which is essentially just like a fancy proxy. It, it's, it's like a proxy project file thing that you would open up. It's, it just, it requires you to have. All the footage right there. So it's small because it's just, it's like a link. Yeah, like a link to your project. And we actually sent it, we had this like hardware H 2 64 ENC coder or something on one of the computers, and we actually did make the real file.
Oh. And it was sitting there on the desktop. It's just that when Ty grabbed it, he grabbed the, the reference file and not the actual file. 'cause I think they had almost the same name. So it was just kind of like a fumbling of, of things. But [00:18:00] yeah, it's just, I remember we loaded on that to the DVD or hard drive or whatever it was.
And it was a tiny little file. Yeah. You know, it's, this can't be a whole movie
Kirk: as an editor, you know, I completely sympathize and empathized, you know, with the situation and, but I'm like, I gotta check. I, I gotta go. This is a gray area. I don't want to make the call. So I. I bumped it up to Mark and Liz, and I remember Liz's response was, is this a can of worms?
You really wanna open? Yeah. And I'm like, no. She's like it, it's late. Yeah. Like, okay, I
Phillip: heard
Kirk: it from the top.
Phillip: It's late. No. The worst part about that was is we, we didn't just throw a three megabyte file on a DVD and then we were good. We tested it, we were testing that file on all the different computers.
We were trying to like do our due diligence, but because we were on a san, all the computers at work we're [00:19:00] linking to. Yep. To the hard drive that actually had the footage. So the reference file worked and even off the DVD it tricked us into thinking it was like an actual movie file that would run Yeah.
Kirk: Uh, the, the problems that can happen. But I mean, it's, it's interesting 'cause the, the drop off now, I think more and more, you know, we're gonna try to do an in-person kickoff, you know, just 'cause we want people to get together and interact and, and, you know, have this sense of comradery and community that.
Is kind of the hallmark of the 48. Yeah. But you know, because of COVID, we've been doing digital drop offs and, uh, Walter, our, our new, you know, technology guy, he created this site called, uh, cinema 48. And you know, it uses a MD five check sum to verify that it's on time. So the upload doesn't have to be done at seven 30.
You just have to have your checksum [00:20:00] done by seven 30, which is, you know, really cool. And on our end, it makes it a lot easier because I don't have to transfer a bunch of files from DVDs and thumb drives anymore. It's just everything's up on cinema. 48, everything's named nicely. I don't have to deal with, you know, 48, 2013, copy, copy, copy, final two, version three, you know, and rename everything.
Everything's just named nicely and there are a lot of stories of people, you know, almost getting hurt coming to the drop off. So even though, you know, it was always a fun kind of event, I think safety, you know, it was taking press, you know, takes precedence. And so I think we're, you know. You're gonna see more and more cities switching over to, you know, digital drop offs from here on out.
Even if Yeah. You know, we get back to some semblance of, of the old normal. Sure. Which, you know, it's, I got mixed, mixed [00:21:00] feelings, you know, mostly kids these days. Yeah. We used to have to take our DVD uphill through the snow running back. It's been on a hundred
Kevin: percent for 15 minutes.
Kirk: We've all been there.
Um, so I mean, let's move on to, uh, uh, criminals. So 2013, tell us a little bit about, because you won best in city for that. You went to FAP Palooza on that one. Tell me a little bit about criminals.
Phillip: Sure. Criminals was like a turning point for us as a team. We were a new team. It was our second year, maybe four or five 40 eights we've done.
Uh, when I was working with Peter face up here, including those, firstly when we made win penguins fly the year before, that was very. Structured as much as possible. I stayed up all night writing a script. We have a lot of friends who are improvisational actors, so we were always gonna rely a little bit on some improvisation, but it was very, [00:22:00] we, as much as possible, we tried to make it formulaic and, you know, write a script basically.
Yeah. For criminals, Ty and I got together and that Friday night, we just could not think of anything. I think we had both had like a really long week of work. Um, I think our friend Nick Davis might have been there too, and he fell asleep on the floor and just like immediately wasn't, uh, you know, it was just down to tie and I, we, we just couldn't come up with anything.
Friday night we, we were, and we were so tired. We were genuinely thinking of just not doing it, and we were gonna quit the next day. And it was probably two in the morning and we kept coming up with all these little shells of an idea. But, um, it was really important to us that we have not just a concept, we always want to have a fairly solid A to B.
It doesn't have to be complex, [00:23:00] but if we don't have a full story, it's not worth everyone's time. That that was kind of a rule for our team. We've, we've seen a lot of 40 eights and there's a lot of things that were just based on like what might be a cool concept or a cool shot or a cool character, but we knew you're not gonna take home the whole thing if you don't have.
A short that actually makes sense and something happens by the end. We didn't have that. We had some funny stuff, but we just didn't have it. So we just agreed like, let's meet back up in the morning, get a couple hours of sleep, and then like, we'll, we'll go get coffee at like seven or eight in the morning and, and we will just decide whether or not we want to just bag this whole thing.
So he called me the next day on the way to meet up at a coffee shop and he basically had, Ty had like this very fledgling idea about a couple of criminals. So anyway, we basically just had almost nothing. We we're, we're already on Saturday, it's seven or eight in the morning. We've got actors. All of our [00:24:00] actors are asking us, send me the script, send me the script.
When are we meeting? Like we have all these people that are waiting on us and we don't have a script, but, but we're having our coffee and we've got some napkins basically. And, and we just, we don't have time to write a whole script. I. We just bullet point everything essentially. We wanna make sure we have a loose idea and we know what's gonna happen at the end.
And we're just kind of, as long as we know what needs to happen sort of in, it was crime gangster was the genre for this. As long as we know what happens in each scene, we can sort of like improv our way through. And, and so we really didn't have much going into criminals, but there was something about that process and, and sort of going in, feeling a little bit, I don't wanna say doomed, but we didn't think we had, and we were already way behind schedule.
We knew that we had to do things differently, both in the way that we were shooting it and in the way that we were writing it and. [00:25:00] Directing it and and editing it. Everything had to change to sort of fit this new timeline of like, we, we gotta do something, otherwise this isn't gonna happen, so let's just do something fun.
So what we ended up doing is, of course we did improvisational scenes with all the actors, but even the way that we shot it was just on sticks. I think everything was just on a tripod and we would hard cut. The edits, which actually ended up giving us this, it, it had its own style. By the end, it didn't feel like a shortcoming.
It actually felt like a style. And we, we kept it going throughout. So we had all these really great improvisational scenes and we were able to just hard cut to a lot of the best moments and give the whole thing this personality. And it just really worked out for us. And we sort of kept that. It, it was a great learning moment for us because we sort of married that, that sense of improvisation and that freedom of acting and of [00:26:00] writing and even of production with some of our more structured elements of like, we knew how to do the, like the script and, and like the beautiful shots with the perfect lighting and not saying we all always.
Achieved that, but like, perfect. We, we married them together and, and I think that criminals is sort of what set challenge accepted on the path to later successes because we learned something on that shoot that just gave us a style and gave us kind of a comedic improvisational.
Kirk: Well, I mean, your, your cast was fantastic.
I mean, Ani and Jesse are, you know, amazing and can't go wrong with Tim Forehand. I mean, he's still, to this day, whenever I see him, I just say, you're a beautiful man. He's a beautiful man. He's a beautiful man. Um,
Phillip: always get a good laugh outta it. Just grab him by the chin strap. [00:27:00] Yeah, you're totally right. I mean, I, I'm talking about the, the filmmaking and postproduction side of it, but like these successes are also just built upon.
Our cast because we've just got great actors and great improvisational actors and yeah. Jesse Ani, they, they, they just killed it. I mean, I couldn't even even anticipated them knocking it out of the park that, well, that was actually our first time working with them directly as well, because I, we usually work with Brian Sutherland, he's a good friend of mine.
I think he had some kind of scheduling conflict or maybe he was with another team or something, I'm not sure. But it, it was, it was so awesome to be able to work with them and they definitely became part of our like, core unit.
Kirk: Let's, let's move on to I Chair. 'cause I, you know, I want to get to Film Palooza and you have two FOMO paloozas, you know, and one can under your belt.
Mm-hmm. So, you know, I was talking with Olivier yesterday. And, uh, you, [00:28:00] we were talking about why, you know, the French and the Dutch films are like, are so, so good. And you know, he said the big difference in his mind was, you know, not that you know, American films or other, you know, other places are bad, but why there seemed to be exceptional year after year after year was that he is like in America.
I think the filmmakers have fun making a movie in 48 hours and in France and, uh, the Netherlands, they make a movie and have fun doing it. You know, just like this. Hmm.
Yeah.
Kirk: Different difference in mindset. He said completely unprompted just started going, you know, chicken in your face. Chicken, chicken in your face.
Someone just posted
Phillip: chicken in your face on Facebook like last week or something too. Yeah. It still,
Kirk: you know, that brings us to eye chairing. I mean, I, I think that was, you [00:29:00] know, you're, you're crowning achievement in your, in your time in the 48. Yeah. I mean, because that it
Phillip: all came together with
Kirk: Yeah.
That, because that was your second best in city win. Mm-hmm. And you know, it, it was very memorable in terms of, you know, the Seattle 48 scene. But, you know, there were people chanting it, uh, you know, film of palooza during the awards. Tell us a little about, uh, I chair how that came
Kevin: about. Unintentional mantra
Phillip: of that film of palooza.
Yeah. Very unintentional. What's that song? Do you want to. Kick us off on that. Um, yeah, I mean, I guess I'll, I'll riff and see what, what comes of it. I do think, yeah, eye sharing was kind of where the lessons learned in previous projects all kind of came together and that was really the marriage of our mobility as a small team.
'cause you know, we were only ever three or four people. I think that was, [00:30:00] was that the first year we actually had like an audio guy there And we weren't doing, we weren't doing audio ourselves. I think that was the first time Mark Messer all was there. So he helped, helped out there. 'cause normally it's just three or four people behind the camera.
And then the actors, it was also, we had our peak lineup of actors and that kind of, I think we hit our stride with the improvisational meets. The story structure thing. I also think that one of the things that we managed not to not to do is, is bite off too much. 'cause that's kind of like, I, I still feel like that would be my Achilles heel and I've done it since then.
But for any new team going in, it's just like, if you can have a simple concept or simple enough to execute in that amount of time, like that's where you can really excel and do a simple thing. Well yeah. And just have a concept that you can [00:31:00] execute and not just be kind of. Not telling a story at all. So,
Kirk: well, I mean, that, that's a really good point, is what I've always admired, you know, about the work that you've done in the 48, is that you really embrace the restrictions and don't necessarily see 'em as, you know, impediments to, to your creativity.
I've always really, really, really, you know, really admired and respected your, uh, kind of verve and gusto for using the restrictions as a, a creative spring point. So I, I think that's a good lesson for other aspiring 48 hour filmmakers and, you know, their careers beyond the 48.
Kevin: Yeah, I mean, one, one thing I will say is that making something unprompted is, is hard, you know, so it, it almost doesn't even feel like deserving of that much credit to go off of those.
'cause it, it really, they. They help you. You know, I, I [00:32:00] think overall they
Phillip: kind of, they take some pressure off of you creatively. They give you a starting point. So you do have to be, you do have to embrace that. And so, yeah, it's just nothing but helpful in my opinion. And I think that like, if you start trying to plan ahead, then you're, you're really removing that kind of asset from your potential, I guess you're removing that potential for creativity.
'cause then you end up sort of shoehorning in these random things into your preconceived idea. And it's just your best results and the best time you're gonna have in writing and the execution and, and even the results is, is just by embracing that I. Chaos and creativity.
Kirk: Yeah, and it's, it's interesting because you know, one of the rules is no pre-writing.
You know, you can do all sorts of prep leading up to [00:33:00] the event weekend, but you can't do any. Writing or story outlining, it's inevitable that you, you're gonna have ideas bouncing around in your head. Mm-hmm. But, you know, formalizing anything like that is, is against the rules.
Phillip: Yeah.
Kirk: And it
Phillip: doesn't help you either.
Kirk: No, no. You end up just shoehorning things in and I mean, even though we've never had, you know, a film pulled because, because of pre-writing, you know, I know it happens and you can pretty much tell, you know, which ones are pre-written and they're, they're very, very rare. But yeah, I mean the, the required elements are just shoehorned in and, you know, all of a sudden this dude pops up, hi, I'm Bob the baker, and, you know, boom off screen, or you know, all of a sudden here's a stapler.
It's pretty obvious that, yeah. But I mean, the funniest thing is there was one year, I can't remember if it was the criminals year, I chairing year, someone came to me. [00:34:00] After, after the, the drop off and said, you know, I know that, uh, challenge accepted prew co-wrote their film. And I said, oh, really? That's funny, because we were all at solo bar at the same time, and I was watching them, you know, I was interacting with them as they were, you know, developing the script.
So, uh, I, I don't know where you got this information, but I know firsthand that it's false.
Kevin: Yeah, yeah. No, we've been accused of it. But again, it's really just that's not how we approach the 48 at all. Yeah. You know, and, and I don't think anyone on the team would enjoy that. And we're busy too. Like no one, we're not meeting up beforehand to put work into it.
It's kind of just like we have jobs and all
Phillip: that. And the nice thing about the 48 is it's encapsulated into a weekend. So we didn't need to, I. Yeah. Anyway, I, I don't, I don't
Kirk: see the point of doing, you know, any, any [00:35:00] pre-work.
Kevin: Yeah. You've been there
Phillip: when we order the pitcher of beer Yep. And bring out the notebooks and, and start from what are the prompts and, and that's how it always begins.
Yeah. The other little anecdote that I was just thinking about that was kind of a fun thing on I, Sharon, and I don't know. I like to think that we were the ones that, kind of, the first ones that did this. I'm sure other people have done it too, but it, but it just kind of was a cool thing and I believe we had to check with you and that was on the line of dialogue.
Oh yeah.
Kirk: Yeah, yeah. Yeah. That's a good, thank you for bringing that up. Yeah. Yeah. Just I wanted to bring that up too.
Kevin: Yeah. I'm proud. An example of the.
Phillip: Thinking outside of the box type of stuff you can do is the line of dialogue can be kind of a tricky thing to, to put in there. Mm-hmm. And what we did on I, Sharon, is we actually, I think the line was No way.
Never [00:36:00] again. Yeah. Something like that. Yeah. Um, we split the lineup between two different people in two different scenes entirely. So one scene ended with one person saying, no way. And then it was a completely different scene and the next person said
Kevin: never again.
Phillip: Uh, and so that was just. I dunno. I was proud of that moment of being able, you would never, ever suspect that that was the line of dialogue.
Kirk: Yeah, I, I remember you guys asked me about that and I was immediately just, yeah, that, that totally works. 'cause the words need to, you know, appear or be spoken, you know, in that order, it doesn't matter. You could have broken it up four different ways. You guys won best use of dialogue for that, didn't you?
I hope so. I hope so. Yeah. Pretty sure you did. 'cause I mean, that it was super clever and very effective.
Kevin: Yeah. Yeah. I think I saw teams do
Phillip: that type of thing in later years, but yeah, I like to think that we sort of [00:37:00]
Kevin: broke open that kind of Yeah, it
Kirk: was, it was a very, very clever and effective way because yeah, you have Brian saying No way, and then cut to Ani, you know, outside, uh, with a completely different emotional response.
Phillip: Yeah,
Kirk: yeah. Uh, so it was, it was very, you know, clever but effective as well.
Phillip: Yeah. That was one of our things too. If, and if you've ever been to a 48, you'll see how you'll see 80 different uses of dialogue. And a lot of them, they stick out like a sore thumb. Our team, like we, we always wanted to make it go by so naturally that you.
Almost wouldn't even know it was there. I always wanted the judges to have to search for it. Just like did they even get the line of dialogue in there? Um, so that was,
Kirk: yeah. Honestly, you know, that's the number one disqualification every year is, is the line of dialogue. Really? I didn't know that. Yeah, it's, people don't get it in, um, or they get it wrong.
Oh yeah. Yeah. Um, [00:38:00] you know, it's just because it must
Phillip: be
Kirk: verbatim, it has to be verbatim, you know, allowing for contractions. Mm. Yeah. It's the number one disqualification. 'cause you know, people just put an extra word in or, you know, yeah. They'll, uh, use a synonym for, you know, an adjective or something, you know, some minor mistake.
And there's at least one. You know, every, every go around that. That'd be really heartbreaking. Don't do that. It's
Kevin: painful.
Kirk: It's really, yeah. It's, it's a hard discussion to have too. Yeah. It's, it's my least favorite part of you, you know, an event that I adore. Yeah. Having to tell someone pick up the line of dialogue wrong.
Yeah.
Phillip: Yeah. Yeah. I, I feel like one last anecdote, and maybe Kevin you wanna speak to this, uh, is talking about the how the, uh, chicken in your face song. Really, I, that's why I was gonna butt in to tell that story really quick because it's, it's not a long [00:39:00] story. I just, the chicken in your face thing has become.
Sort of a, a thing like it, like you were talking about in Film of Palooza, people were chanting it in the lobby, people were chanting it on stage when they're given the awards, it just, it, it sort of has had taken on a life of its own for those without context in eye chair and someone gets hit in the face with a chicken.
Um, now how that came about was completely out of nowhere. We were in the edit and the audio recorder was upstairs. We, the, the evening we were packing up after the whole shoot. The actors were upstairs just getting outta the way and they were just like bored waiting for us to pack up the lights and the camera and everything.
And, and the audio guy was up there and he had his recorder and the actors were just killing time again. They're very improvisational and they're hilarious. So they were just free styling. They just recorded it and they just [00:40:00] started freestyling this song. And the song was actually a perfect length. It was really tight.
And they, they just started riffing on this chicken in your face, chicken in your face, freestyle rap. And it, it just fit perfectly into the credit sequence. And I found it just going through the files. No one told me about it. No one, it, it was never supposed to be a thing. I just found it as I was searching for like, what are these extra audio files?
The last on the audio? And, and so it just ended up being in there. I was like, well, I gotta use this. This is too good. And so it just ended up being plopped into the credits and now it's legend. That's a thing. Legend. It's legend. I also thought it was funny in Film of Palooza that no one knows how to say I chair in.
Yeah. I mean there, we don't even have a rule for it. I don't even, you know, I don't care how it's said, but I. The, the announcers were always like, I, Sharon, [00:41:00] and then it would be like, then it would cut to video and it's like, for best acting ensemble, I, Sharon, you know, it's just every time it was mentioned, it was said in a different way.
Yeah. Which is, which is great. And we knew that. And it's also sort of a joke in the film, so Yeah. Which is even funnier because it's, it's a joke in
Kirk: the film.
Kevin: Yeah, that makes sense. Meta a beautiful name. It's a beautiful, I'm gonna have to go watch, watch this again. It's been a while. Yeah.
Kirk: Yeah. So, you know, I, Sharon did amazingly well, you know, one best in City.
We went to Film of Palooza and it, it was really funny because, you know, mark contacted me, you know, very cryptically. He's like, so do you know if the Harvey's are, are are gonna come? And I'm like, you know, I don't know. Maybe, maybe not. He's like, well. They're, they're in line for some awards. Can you contact them and, you know, kind of sweet talk 'em to coming in, [00:42:00] coming without letting them know that they're in the running for some awards.
And I'm like, mark, I'm not that devious. I,
Kevin: that's a, that's a delicate,
Kirk: I don't know how to do that without tipping my hat.
Kevin: How do you subtly tell people to buy plane tickets and book a hotel and all that kind of stuff?
Kirk: But, you know, this brings us up to film and palooza and, you know, film and Palooza is coming up this year.
And as you guys well know, it's a fantastic event. It's tons and tons of fun. Tell me a little bit about New Orleans and, uh, Los Angeles
Phillip: Nolins. Man, I know some stories about this one that can't be told on. Yeah, I'm not gonna tell all my new, it's an adventure. I mean it's, I think especially for the types of, potentially the types of teams that are working in the 48, and especially if you're just getting into filmmaking and stuff, it's getting into a film festival and getting to go is, I always thought that was kind of like a filmmaker's dream.
It's like, oh, you know, you get to submit your [00:43:00] film and go travel around and show it and meet, meet new people. It's absolutely, the 48 is actually, I think the most fun film festivals I've ever been to, and I think for a couple reasons is if you've made a 48 hour film. I mean, you're instantly relating to everyone else who's there.
You've all been through this thing together. You, you have shareable moments already, and if you've made it to film a palooza, that's just kind of an even tighter circle. Like it comes instantly with respect and kind of excitement. 'cause you're all there. And you know that you're gonna be watching and, and you know that you're talking to people who have nailed their city already.
There's so many different ways of approaching the 48 that it's, it's really incredible to see what, what everyone has done. When you get to FOMO Palooza, you know, there's usually some [00:44:00] networking events to kick things off, and I remember New Orleans was. Was like, I got into New Orleans and I was the only one there.
I didn't know anyone, so it was a little bit intimidating, but I actually just kind of sat down at a table and you know, got a beer and I ended up, the first people I talked to, I still am in sort of context to them to this day. They live in London, in Scotland, and it's like, whether you know it or not, it's your team and it's your scene.
Everyone, everyone there is someone who you're probably gonna get along with, probably gonna have a lot of things in common with a lot of things to share. And then it's really, once the films start, it's both exciting and also intimidating. Because you really are in a room full of really talented people and it's mind blowing what people have, have been able to come up with.
I still show people some of the, the films, the winning films from other cities to this day of just, you've gotta see this beautiful French film. You know, another thing I noticed [00:45:00] that I think is really unique about the film of Palooza, I think you see it at Filma Palooza is the dreaded drama. No one wants to get drama when you're in your city thing 'cause it's really difficult.
But when you get to film of Palooza and you see people who have gotten drama and just nailed it, those films I think tend to stand out and stand above all of this sort of silliness of the comedies and, and things like that. It's, it's really, really impressive when you see those, those teams that they're, they really embrace drama and they, and they get it right.
So it's, in some ways I think the, the comedic ones are a little bit of an easier way out, and it's, it's maybe, it, it's definitely, I think, more fun and it, it might be easier to even win your city, but when you get to film a palooza, the dramas are gonna kick ass. Mm-hmm. And [00:46:00] so it's just one of the things I've noticed to, to, to give people maybe some incentive to, if, if you raise that challenge.
Yeah. If you want to go above and beyond even your city and you want to, you know, make a film that, that shows up the rest of the planet drama is, is that's your. That's your ticket right there.
Kirk: Yeah. It's, you know, it's rare that, you know, a comedy will make it into like the top three. And that's why 2000 film Palooza 2015 when I failed to, you know, subtly coerce you guys to go, go down, you know, I was running through, you know, the list of awards and I was like, ah, you know, what could, what could they have won?
Well. Ensemble, best ensemble acting. That's, you know, if there's one that's a given. Yeah. And you did get that. Yeah. I'm glad we got that one because I remember I was helping call the show up to Nicole in the booth. So I'm on my phone kind of at the back of the theater calling out the, the awards as they're being announced so she could put it up on the [00:47:00] screen.
And you guys, you guys were nominated for best directing and best writing? I think so, yeah. Yeah. Complete shock. Because, you know, I'd seen some of the other films and, you know, and American comedy being, you know, nominated. That's, that's crazy.
Yeah.
Kirk: Yeah. That's cool. And then when they announced, you know, like the top four, it was like, holy crap, when you guys were announced, as you know.
Oh, so you didn't know those were announced either? I didn't know. I had no idea, mark. I didn't even know that you guys had locked up ensemble.
Phillip: Yeah,
Kirk: I mean, I. Was pretty certain that was the nomination. 'cause your cast was, you know, phenomenal.
Phillip: A testament to our cast that Yeah, the obvious one would be ensemble acting because they killed it.
Yeah, they were amazing.
Kirk: People were reciting the chicken in your face. Chicken, chicken in your face. I mean, all through film of palooza. It's kind of funny because uh, when you guys were announced as, as third. I'm still live on the phone with Nicole as she hits play and when I saw it pop up, [00:48:00] I just started screaming and she's like, oh my God.
Take, you know, hang up, hang up.
Phillip: Yeah. That's so cool.
Kirk: That film sent you guys as part of the contingent to, to Can that year.
Phillip: Yeah. Yeah. Who'd have thought? We never What?
Kirk: What a moment,
Phillip: man.
Kirk: I mean yeah, tell me about that. 'cause you know, I've never been to one of the, the short film corner screenings at Can,
Kevin: I feel like I want to, I wanna just put a capstone for me on
Phillip: the on film Za.
'cause I think that leads into going to can as well. So yeah, even starting locally you gained so much experience and so much networking. And even if you never leave the city, I still feel like that's, that's a big part of mm-hmm. Who I am and even, even like my career and, and the work I do and all that. So that alone is incredibly important.
And then you go to Film of Palooza and that's where the networking becomes somewhat global and there can be filmmaking opportunities [00:49:00] and things like that, collaboration that happens as a result of that. But you also now end up having friends all over the world and it's like, I've traveled through Europe and England and Ireland and it's just, you know, people everywhere.
I've visited people in Amsterdam and France and Italy and it's so amazing how that happens. And you, you just kind of. I get to have this feeling of now existing on more of a global scale and have a, a much larger idea and yeah, something that we, I don't think ever really expected when we started doing this stuff.
And we definitely never expected that we would be going to the canned film festival to be screening and, and seeing a bunch of those people again. And so pretty surreal. You really don't think of, oh, I'm gonna do the 48 hour film festival for my city and then suddenly find yourself in France eating oysters and drinking rose [00:50:00] and
Kirk: well, yeah, the last in person, uh, 48 was in Rotterdam and.
I'd never, I'd never been to the Netherlands, so I was like super excited and, uh, Hans and Sper put on, you know, an amazing film of palooza. And just down the street there was kind of this, you know, international food court with fantastic food, and that's where everyone would, you know, eat in between screenings.
And I ran into, uh, sit, say run into that guy everywhere. Yeah. I mean, he wasn't in film that year, but, you know, Netherlands isn't big, so he came down anyway. And, uh, after we caught up a little bit, he, he immediately asked about YouTube. Yeah, yeah. Oh, that's cool. Had
Kevin: beers with him in, in Amsterdam one time when I was there.
Kirk: Yeah. It's, you know, he just got family all over the, all over the world now. It's fantastic. Yeah,
Phillip: it is. It's kind of a funny thing too, if you, if you do end up going to multiple filma paloozas is you do see some repeat offenders and it's kind of cool to be like, Hey, you again, eh. [00:51:00] Just can't stop winning our own city.
Huh. And that's, that's really cool. And, and you do form a bond over that as well. Alright, so can tell me about it.
Kevin: Well, it's one way to feel like small fish in a big pond.
Phillip: Yeah. Can was really, I, I think it was really interesting and really eyeopening, I wanna say in terms of like wall to wall fun. I think film Will Palooza is actually more fun than Can.
Yeah. Obviously can Is it's massive. It's intimidating. There's obviously lots of money being spent. I, I thought it was really fascinating to see like, can is not only a film festival. I think maybe like, it was originally actually just, I don't know what you'd call it. It, it's like a business thing. It's like a marketplace for films.
And when you were in those buildings, you would just go and you would see. Just huge rooms [00:52:00] full of people who were selling their movies, you know, all the posters and all the billboards. And one thing that we were being told when we were at Cannes that I, I think became, it became very true and very and more meaningful after I fully understood kind of the magnitude of Cannes Film Festival, is that we didn't just get our short film into Cannes, it was actually screening at can, so people could come and attend, because that's a difference between the short film corner, um, versus actually having a, a theater room booked and screening your film.
There are two mm-hmm. Separate things. Yeah. So to be able to say that you've actually had a, a film screen at Cannes, I, I don't think most people would probably know the difference, but once you're there, you know that there is a difference. There's, there is the short film corner and there's. Tons of, I'm sure, very talented short film makers from all over the world.
A lot of them aren't [00:53:00] actually screening films there. They've had films that are accepted and they basically have like a little internet database almost that they, if they can convince someone to come watch their film, they, they can go into the back room and watch, watch their film. Uh, but it's not actually screening there.
So, so there is a huge difference.
Kirk: That is a, that is a massive distinction. I did not know that.
Phillip: Yeah. Yeah. We were actually like, on the schedule that people could look at and go to. Right. Wow. Yeah, so, so it was, it, it was kind of in, in some ways intimidating and humbling. I think just who Phil and I are as people is, it is like a big, I I'm sure a lot of other people who've been to camp probably I.
Took away different experiences, but I think we were, you know, humbled, intimidated. And I, I remember in the preparation, the lead up to going to Cannes, there's, there's a lot of ideas from people. It's just [00:54:00] like, you gotta get together. You put like an iPad on your chest that's showing your film and you gotta like, go up to people and like shake their hands.
And there's these lightning bolt moments that people are hoping for of like meeting someone at a party that's gonna make your career or some, something like that. And I just, I I that it's a level of like putting yourself out there. Especially once I was in the short film corner and I saw a business person walking through and a bunch of young filmmakers trying to beg them to like, come watch their film as they're just trying to go do their job, buy a feature film from Portugal.
You know, that's what I gotta do today. We were not those people who were, who were gonna be like throwing ourselves in traffic. To to, to try to scrape together and an opportunity sobering
Kevin: reality of the, that side of, of con. But yeah.
Phillip: Yeah,
Kevin: I think really the best
Phillip: part about it was the 48 group and, and [00:55:00] just being able to see all those people and continue building those networks.
'cause those are your peers, you know? Yeah. I'm sure the, the lightning strike stories are cool, but it's certainly like, if that's all you were there for then I think you're missing a lot of the best parts of it. 'cause overall it was crazy amazing. It's amazing to see all those people from all over the world.
Again, the top 10 films got to screen there
Kirk: between 10 and 14, usually every one, 10
Phillip: and 14. Yeah, that's where I just think it's funny, like. Seeing sit se. 'cause it just seems like, you know, I am. Uh, all right, I'm in New Orleans. I walk into a room, sit, say's there with a beer, Hey man, I'm in Hollywood. It's just like, oh now, now I'm in Phim Bowl in France and you know, I go out into the back gathering area.
There's sit say, what's going on? You know, it's just like,
Kirk: yeah, he was here. He was here in Seattle, you know, when we hosted in 2017. That's right. And that was, you know, it was weird seeing him at Solo, [00:56:00] you know? Totally. Yeah. There he is.
Kevin: He's a character. He's a funny. Funny actor that tends to be in a lot of winning films
Phillip: from Amsterdam, right?
Or the Netherlands.
Kevin: Yeah.
Phillip: Just for some added context. So he's definitely the, the kind of guy that you don't mind
Kevin: seeing in a room and being like, Hey, you know, because he's kind, he's a good dude. He's a
Kirk: really
Kevin: good dude.
Kirk: Yeah. It's very down to earth and agree. So I, I kinda wanna wrap this up is I've been talking to city producers basically for, you know, the last couple of days.
And one panel that, you know, we've been trying to focus on every year at FMA lately has been, you know, life after the 48. It's always a kind of a mixed, I have a mixed bag of emotions, you know, and I say, Hey, are you gonna do the 48 this year? And someone says, can't. I'm too busy. You know, I'm both, I'm both saddened and, you know, excited at that prospect that someone who has gone through, you know, my event [00:57:00] is now too busy to do it, working in the field, you know, I'm always saddened and excited by that.
And, uh, you two haven't done it. No, you know, quite a while at this point. And you're both, you know, very, very busy and it's really rewarding to see that, you know, very happy for your personal and professional success post 48. So, you know, what have you been up to? What's, what's life like now?
Phillip: Well, I mean, I touched on it a little bit earlier, but I think this applies to both of us, but filmmaking was really the, uh, laid the groundwork for both Kevin and my career.
And some of that is overlapping and we work together, but a lot of it is separate. You know, we both work in video production now, shooting, editing, but yeah, like, I didn't necessarily. Graduate school having studied this and pursued what I'm doing now, like we were pursuing filmmaking. Um, and as a filmmaker you have to learn like every part of [00:58:00] the production process.
'cause if you want your film to be made, you're the one that has to do it. Um, or, or you're at least like working right alongside somebody that's, that's doing that. So it exposes you to so much. And the 48, 'cause we've done it, what, five, six times, I don't know, seven times in various forms in different teams.
Like that's a lot of kind, I mean you could call it trial by fire, but. You gain a lot of experience there. And it definitely was the foundation that I built my whole professional video production career on. You know, those were the things on the resume that looked good. Those were some of the first accolades.
You also can, can win some cool stuff. Like I've probably got a few thousand dollars worth of software, things that were prizes throughout the years on, on various things. So, but mostly, yeah, it's just, it's the networking, it's the experience you get [00:59:00] and everything I do now is built upon those experiences.
What do you do now? That's a good point. Um, yeah, I mean, over, uh, over the years I've, I've done all kinds of stuff as a freelance editor primarily, but also a video producer. I mean, we've. We've done sports content, music content, and traveled the world with Macklemore and Ryan Lewis done museum content with Kevin.
What else? A lot of advertising out of home stuff, which is video, billboards. And currently I'm working for 3, 4, 3 industries, which is the studio game studio that makes Halo Infinite. So that's what I've been doing for the last couple of years. So it's just really, I've had such a broad range of things that I've been able to be exposed to.
It's just been awesome.
Kirk: I get to work with you in kind of a secondhand fashion on, uh, we take the low road. When I was help, uh, make the final files, I was [01:00:00] in touch with you quite a bit, getting, uh, new renders for certain shots. Yeah,
Phillip: that's. That's right. What was that? Wait, that was like a couple of, uh, like special effects shots.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah. Actually, Ty just hit me up for another special effects shot too. So I, I do that every now and then. It's is, um, I got more into like motion graphics after effects, compositing, visual effects.
Kirk: There's money in that. There's money in that.
Phillip: Yeah, there is. I mean, it's, if, if all the money and all the time I spent, like, as a filmmaker, you can even see like the camera, the first camera we've got back there.
It's like, that's, that was a paperweight like a month after I bought it. Uh, just 'cause technology moves so fast, DSLRs came out and just the, the one thing that. Would've that really keeps my lights on is just if I, uh, learning after effects and editing, but that, that's the software side is what really did it for [01:01:00] me.
Mm-hmm. And it works with my introvertedness too, to just be in a room Exactly. With my computer. So, yeah, I've, I've, and that's a lot of what I've been doing too. So I, I was a producer at the Museum of Pop Culture in Seattle, a producer, editor, and just did a little of everything there, which I liked, you know, lot, lots of interviews, bought, lots of editing, some motion graphics.
At this point, I, I finally just went freelance again, so now I just, I do a lot of work for ad agencies and as a product of the pandemic, everything's remote, which has kind of opened me up in a really weird way, so. Mm-hmm. I work with agencies in Chicago, New York, primarily la and just do a lot of. Editing and motion and get to work from home.
And
Kirk: that's always nice. Yeah. Well, Philip and Kevin, thank you so much. This is a great, great discussion and hopefully we will, you [01:02:00] know, convince some people to come to DC and future film of Paloozas. 'cause you know, it's, it's my favorite time of year and
Phillip: yeah. Yeah. If you got the chance to go to film a Palooza.
Uh, would highly recommend it.
Kirk: Yeah. I always like to, you know, joke that if I need a, a room to stay in and, uh, you know, Lum, Batar, Mongolia, I got one.
Yeah,
Phillip: totally. It, it is absolutely, it's absolutely worth going. I mean, that is a prize to shoot for. That's where you're gonna meet the people. You know, Ty sent was in London like a couple months ago and sent me a picture with some of the people we met when we were in Film Palooza in New Orleans.
And just, you will become sort of a global presence. You will see films that blow your mind. It's just, it's an opportunity that you shouldn't miss if you win. It's foolish to not go to film Appalooza. And if you're doing the 48, it's definitely a, a prize that's [01:03:00] worth putting your all into it. No matter what happens, it's just like the, the skills that you learn along the way.
If, if you're doing this on a regular basis, it's, it's, it's worth money. It's worth your time. It's just every aspect of this, uh, 48 challenge and, and any filmmaking challenges, it pays dividends.
Kirk: All right. That, that sum up will make, uh, mark very happy. Well, thank you so much and, uh, thanks, Kirk. Can't wait until we, you know, get back to some sort of normal, so I can, you know, see you in person again.
Get a grab a pair solo one of these days. Awesome.